Tenacity! Some say the act of completing a 4 year degree is a way to demonstrate it. I’d say completing any large, multi-year project is a good way to show that you’ve got determination.

On the flip side, some people don’t know when to give up 😉

“Can self-inspiring determination be taught though?” Watching my baby niece, I’m wondering if a better question is whether we can refrain from beating it out of people.

Seriously. She will make the most horrible faces when trying a new food, but in most cases will then swallow it and ask for more.

She is now to the stage where she can walk as good as a drunk, but she tries really hard not to hang on to things to get somewhere. Even when she’s swaying dangerously to one side, instead of grabbing the nearest object, she will try, usually successfully, to catch her balance on her own.

What makes her often choose the hard way to do something? The sheer pleasure of success?

We never tell babies after they’ve tried standing thousands of times a day for weeks on end and still can’t do it that maybe they should realize they’re not the sort of person who stands and move on to something else. No, we keep helping them, cheering them on, and, when they cry, hugging them.

Later we learn there are such a things as failure and embarrassment. What makes us want only quick successes? What makes us avoid the discomfort of learning new things, especially while people are watching? What makes us not only seek the easy way out but sometimes even expect everything to be easy and for everything to go perfectly according to plan?

That British series of documentaries following children through adulthood (and now middle age) is worth reviewing. I started watching it when 28-Up hit the theatres here in the US and on through the sequels (35-up, 42-up, etc.). The little boy who became a jockey and then taxicab driver probably showed the most determination to change his circumstances.

@Seth – Damn, I completely forgot that one. Probably subconsciously. My brain is like a sieve.

Determination comes from having a terminus ad quem [see the Latin affinities?], a goal or end toward which one is working. In Aristotelian metaphysics, the telos or end is the cause that determines or draws an act to its completion as it is moved by the efficient cause. In your example, study is the efficient cause of the high GPA, but getting the job is the end of the high GPA. Though Trish’s post on SIF yesterday had its share of those who believe study for its own sake is a sufficient t.a.q.

So, in a nutshell, determination comes from having a goal that is so compelling that it drives us to persevere until it is accomplished.

I think a great GPA is more related to willingness to jump through hoops than the ability to think for oneself, but I never wanted to pursue a doctorate.

On a related note, anyone ever notice how determined people are incredibly annoying?

The SAT and GPA don’t test intelligence, only rote learning. Of this, I am certain. Intelligence, like determination, cannot be measured, therefore cannot be tested. Because schools want to test outcomes, they choose outcomes that are testable, then encourage those, eg. memorisation and recall, spelling and grammar, form over function, product over process.

@ Debbie M – I fully agree with your way of framing the question. Children are born curious, loving and persistent. Somehow (12 years of formal education?) we’re able to beat most of it out of them.

@ Ryan – I agree that most people require a shock to wake up, choose an “end” and pursue it. For me, it was a week-long stay in the hospital. It was just a scare, but I determined to make a lot of changes in my life since then.

I think it is important to distinguish between determination and habit. A good example of this is that determination is when you PR in a race but habit is when you stick to a training plan.

In essence, determination is for short and extremely difficult tasks (example: Acing a final exam) while habit is for longer drawn-out processes (example: Earning an A in the class).

For some (many?) there is fine line between determination & obsession. This type of personality must be careful about what they let themselves get involved in. Channeled properly it is a great gift to have. 20+ years ago I was pre-diabetic, at 254 lbs. By scarring myself about the complications of the disease, I got my weight down to 172lbs & have no symptoms. I have maintained my diet as one of the top priorities in life. Is it determination or obsession, I do not know, but it is a powerful force to have when the chips are down.

Re: This Post
Followership not being a dictionary word is not necessarily well-correlated with the importance of the concept. Besides that, however, I think I agree that determination is mostly a quality that occurs when somebody is fundamentally dissatisfied with the current state of things (or rather when there is a “terminus ad quem” as Maus called it).

Re: Jonah Lehrer Article
It’s interesting in the comments how many of the self-claimed scientists seemed to have serious criticism of the article’s main point or at best only offered vague support (see the “debugging by confessional” comment). In contrast, a lot of non-scientists or otherwise undeclared people seemed to agree that it was a rather well-done piece.

“Determination” – I call it persistence (or stubbornness, when I see it in my 5yo)

I don’t think it can be taught, or else we would see more of it; in our leaders, in our communities, in our friends.

Where determination comes from? Suggestions that seem promising to me:

– Maus: having a really compelling goal
– Steve Pavlina (at least my interpretation): building character strength thru training: every 30 days, train/learn something new (such as a new habit)
– Idea of my own: a personality trait like autonomous thinking

One more. I’d say that of the above 3, I happen to be good at 1 and 3, but not 2 (discipline). Oddly, I have great discipline when it comes to being frugal (likely because my parents taught me that way). I have less discipline when it comes to working hard (I could say it’s because I could get good grades in school without working hard, but that sounds like an excuse 🙂

I’d love to hear how other people here would rate themselves.

Although there is undoubtedly a genetic factor to determination and grit, it is also clearly something that is strongly dependent on cultural and social circumstances, as well as on the way the rest of your present psyche is behaving. I feel like supporting these statements but that would fill pages, so I’ll spare you.

More importantly, determination, like intelligences, can be trained, presumably up to some innate potential. Without training, most people would not have the determination to run for 30 min. – but, conversely, almost anyone can be trained to run a marathon. Similarly, not many people could write a phd thesis straight off – but most people could with proper training write such a thesis. You just need the training to get an overview of the problem, to get the tools, skills, and understanding to break down the problem into smaller problems, and the assurance that you’ll reach a goal if you persist. With such training, you can easily summon determination.

Another point to make is that determination is usually the result of an addiction, fear, or other driving psychological force. For a nerd like me, much of my determination comes from the addiction to positive stimulus obtained through problem-solving, from using my skills and from my pride and identity in doing so. Similarly, I probably still try to live up to childhood praise and expectation, now doled out by my own self-image; this is both reward and fear creating determination.

For the last couple of years, my determination has been relatively weak, mostly for lack of goals. I am caught between two conflicting views: ambition and pride seem like vain, self-imposed shackles; on the other hand, laziness seems unethical. Conversely, ambition/pride/etc. are natural and good tools, whereas happiness is a pretty selfish and useless goal in itself. And so on – one of the usual intellectual wastes of time… I try to solve it by ignoring it, and simplifying things: food on the table for my kids is the top priority; this demands work; other priorities, like pursuing personal contentment or doing good in the world, can be pusued thereafter. However, without big goals that I can take seriously, I remain too lazy.

You are using the wrong word: It is not called followership nowadays. It is known by a more catchy “Team player” tag now 😉

So, are you a “team player”?

I think insecurity and frustration work together to produce drive for most people.

What is frustration? Being blocked on goal completion.

Why do you want to complete goals? Because of positive feedback loops. External validation. Internal pride.

Why do you want validation or pride?
Underlying insecurity.

And why are you insecure?
Childhood usually. A feeling of deprivation maybe. Or being told continually, either directly or indirectly, that you aren’t good enough, that you’ll never have items A,B,C or skills X,Y,Z.

This nytimes article lists insecurity as one of the three major forces behind “success.” http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/26/opinion/sunday/what-drives-success.html

“It’s that generates drive: a chip on the shoulder, a goading need to prove oneself. ”

I know that the childhood friends of mine that were more secure (richer households, more loving parents that always told them they were “awesome” no matter what their objective performance was) lack drive and consistent execution in their lives. (Doesn’t make them any less fun to hang out with, but they’re not as successful.)

Thanks for the post, it’s always interesting.

determination comes in different classes. To run a marathon today is not a death defying act, rather it’s difficult yet conventional. To run a marathon in 1896 at the first modern Olympics required the conviction that it could be done at all without dying – this required what I call “differential conviction driven by a need to show them all that they are wrong by doing it”. To refuse to Heil Hitler at Nuremberg required determination. To write a book about how bad Hitler was does not require determination. Clara Louise Maass (June 28, 1876 – August 24, 1901) was an American nurse who died as a result of volunteering for medical experiments to study yellow fever – she was quite determined.

so, we have
reliable
committed
determined
driven
stubborn
fanatical

whether any of these are applied as laudatory or pejorative depends on the POV of the describer.

For me, determination comes from the combination of circumstances and genetic disposition.

I was once told that not all German Shepard dogs are suitable for K9 services. The work actually requires a health dose of OCD to get the job done. Well, I think the same can be said about being determined – it requires stubbornness and the desire to overcome obstacle. We need both the internal drive and the external trigger.

I see the right personality meeting the right environment will produce “determination”. Neither can be taught or bought; perhaps family up-bring and culture conditioning will help somewhat. Ultimately, it is the little spark that refuses to settle makes the difference.

In the long long, wisdom needs to kick in to ensure that the quest is an enjoyable one and the time and efforts invested are constructive and worthwhile.

Love this site and happy to put in my 1 1/2 cents.

NickV said,
GPA is the closest thing to determination-testing we’ve got in the United States.

Nope, Entrepreneurship is…