Oh dear — I’m an Idealist and my husband is a Rational — I feel so…obvious!

Hey I’m a INTJ too! The evil mastermind classification.

I am an INFJ-borderline-P and ideally(!) I strive to have most of the qualities (never got the hang of snowboarding) of all these categories listed because that would make me well-rounded, wise and off the charts in the personal growth sector. ha. I am a tortured soul…

I once took a personality test that split everyone into four similar groups. The test was designed so that it was impossible to get a tie score, but I got as close to one as possible.

This was part of a seminar, so after the test we were split up into groups based on whichever group our score was highest in. So I joined the Guardians. Each group worked together to answer some questions and while most people in my group agreed with each other, I just could not agree that a “fun” thing to do was “exercise.” I probably liked exercising as much as anyone else in that group, but I would never use that word to describe what was fun. What was fun was whooshing down the road fast or catching a disc under someone’s leg. I said, “Excuse me, I don’t think I belong here.”

I looked longingly at the Rationals (my favorite people to hang with), but I knew their idea of fun would be taking things apart and putting them back together and writing computer programs. But no, they liked reading books and seeing plays and other things that sounded fun to me, so I stayed there.

My favorite question which I felt could tell you which group you really fell into was: If you could get paid in one of the following two ways, which would you pick and why?
* Get $80,000 a year, 1/12 of it each month.
* Get $110,000 a year, a random amount each month.

The Guardians picked the first option. The Rationals picked the second option. The Guardians asked, “but what do you do in those months when you make hardly any money?” The Rationals said, “You save up for those months.” The Artisans said, “Save, Schmave! You wing it.” The Idealists didn’t say anything–in the system we had, they were the people-persons of the group, so I assumed they would do whatever their spouse wanted them to do.

I figured out that I’m a Rationalist but that many of my tools are Guardian tools (planning and organizing). I realized that “winging” skills, while scary sounding, would also be nice to have. I couldn’t even imagine what those would be at the time. Now I imagine they could do things like call their creditors and explain, get loans from friends, charge up their credit cards, crash on someone’s couch, do without for a month or two, and call back favors from when they were rich. Maybe also negotiate IOUs and deliberately write bad checks which they could probably pay off the following month.

Near the end of the session, the leader asked what the world would be like if one of the types didn’t exist. People agreed that they wanted Rationals in the world, though they might not like actually looking at them or trying to talk to them, because they wanted them in their labs creating cool stuff for everyone. They wanted Guardians to keep things in order, or the world would be a huge disaster area. They wanted Artisans to keep the world exciting and fun. And they wanted Idealists because otherwise people wouldn’t be nice enough to each other.

So in dealing with other types, just remember what’s most important to them and put things in terms they care about. Like if you’re asking for a raise, tell Idealists why you deserve one because of your hard work and making a difference in the company, remind Guardians why raises exist and explain how you qualify, remind Artisans how you make the company a more fun place to work with more interesting products/services, and tell the Rationalists how you’ve increased the bottom line.

Note: in my group, the Artisans were by far the smallest minority, and not just because I work in a bureaucracy. We were told these were the smallest minority out in the real world, too.

I’m an IN(t/f)J. I’m really low scoring on being either an NT or an NF, so I’m on the line between being an Idealist and a Rational. It depends on my mood.

1) I disagree with you about travel. There’s a lot to be explored outside of the US. I spent the summer of 2008 in Valencia, Spain and I didn’t regret a penny that I spent on that trip, even if my host brother tried to kill me and my host family purposefully made me sleep 3 hours or less a night. It was an interesting lesson about people, plus the water was warm (a very, very important thing when you break out in hives when the ambient temperature goes below 55 F – cold urticaria exists!) and there were a lot of museums to explore. I ended up speaking a very good level of Spanish by the end. Language acquisition in a foreign country cannot be beat.

2) I was beginning to feel very guilty. I don’t see uncluttering as a reflection of my personal growth. Because I’m only 18 and just starting out, I don’t actually have a lot of stuff. The minimalism blogs serve more as a reminder not to accumulate useless junk than anything else.

3) This is true. I plan on getting work done with as soon as possible so that I can work towards my goal of leaving this world a better place than I found it.

I’m INTJ, according to some test we took in a psych class, but your 3 statements kind def throw me..

1) I’m up for an amazing experience, if it fits into my schedule, and I am somewhat interested and it doesn’t impact anything else I have planned. Snowboarding on a rock would probably not peak my interest 😉

2) I’m a pack rat in the process of simplifying, but I don’t think I’ll ever truly detach from “things”.

3) Agree with the first part (no point in working for work’s own sake), but not sure about the second depending on your definition of “need”. I’ve only been working for 4 years, but so far, I love it and right now I could see myself continuing indefinitely. But that may be optimistic, given my inexperience 🙂

I am an INTJ as well.

1. I have no interest in parties or snowboarding. However, I do love to travel. Most of my travel has been geared towards archaeology, foreign languages, or wilderness skills.

2. I see decluttering as a reflection of increased self-sufficiency.

3. I began saving for early retirement about two months after I started working. I like my work fine, but there are about a thousand other things I would like to do before I die.

@James D – I recently discovered team sports. I like it because there is an added complexity to the game that does not exist in single sports (which was the only thing I did until I was about 30). I have a hard time paying attention to spectator sports though. I like it as wall paper; if I can bring a book.

@Benjamin – You’re a rational alright. You’re skeptical about my travel statement. You see decluttering as a means to an end rather than the end itself: a tool. And it terms of work, I think you made my point 🙂 Guardians like work simply because it is work, not for its inherent qualities (whether it is interesting, say)

What’s the Myers-Briggs classification for the type that always forgets what Myers-Briggs classification they are?

I’m that one.

I’m an INTJ and a Rational myself, but then again…

I don’t care to get a photo taken, but snowboarding is fun. Maybe in the same way that living on a boat would be fun? Then again I think that scary things and exercise are fun, and snowboarding just combines these two passions!!!

I also look at my “decluttered” life as a symbol of my spiritual detachment from things. I like to go into other people’s messy homes and feel like I am better than them – oh wait, does that make me a meany pants elitist? Whatever, it works for me.

AND I think work is important for works own sake. It’s good for you. Of course my definition of “work” includes learning to repair bicycles and writing blogs. Basically anything that adds value to the world and requires effort. Force times distance, if you will.

Buy hey, not everything is so cut and dry. I’m an INTJ, but I love schedules, I make life changes on a whim, and I highly value authenticity.

This entry reminds me of a Dungeons & Dragons type of (computer?) game where you have to choose your character class and then play according to its own inherent strengths and weaknesses. I’ve noticed that success in those games is usually easier when you team up with players from the various classes rather than as a team of a single class. I wonder if real life is the same?

Hah! to the INTJ instruction page. I used to hang out with a largely INTJ social group in San Diego–I got the hang of it just fine. 5although I didn’t try to tell people I wasn’t INTJ myself because they had this thing against F-types. Sheesh

My type varries too and I distrust the whole categorizing thing, but I’m usually something of an INFX–I can get my act together when I really have to, but tend towards chaos–which is why keeping it simple is a good strategy for me.

I can’t say I mind amazing experiences, but I don’t seek out extreme sports or competative sports–amazing to me is more like learning to cross country ski and being alone in the mountains or meditating.

Uh, that said, I HATE clutter. I cannot live in clutter and I will actually de-clutter other people I go to stay with or anyone in sight (DH, my parents, my in-laws). I admit that this is an annoying characteristic, but I never knew it could be explained by the type system.

And work . . . I am a recovering workaholic. Even now, if I get absorbed in a task I think is important or believe in, it’s hard to stop–and if I do physically stop, I’m probably still thinking about it! But not just for the sake of working–one must prioritize!

What I am curious about are the people who love their work. Do incompetent bosses not bother you? Lying, manipulative bosses? Lazy coworkers? Gossipy coworkers? What about coworkers and/or bosses who try to scapegoat you?

I can’t believe I’m the only one who has experienced those things. So, either the people who love their jobs haven’t worked long enough to experience these things, or they have a way of coping and/or they just don’t let it bother them.

I wish I could do that.

@Benjamin – The real world is full of “leaders” whose only justification for existence is “managing” their employees by thinking up new procedures so they can write something like “Implemented a Six Star Alpha Bravo process of weekly reviews to quantify group productivity” in their resumes. Officially this will be sold as a learning experience and an “opportunity”—mandatory of course—for employees to share their work with the “community” (meaning people you otherwise never talk to). Don’t know if you ever read Dilbert, but it’s all true 🙂

I really liked the bit added at the bottom. That guide made me laugh. It’s so true. 🙂 I wish every future manager of mine would read that guide.

My business school is trying to mold me into being a leader. I don’t think I am one. I would rather let someone else take the responsibility for the group, unless everything’s being handled in a retarded way.

and one more thing…

A professor in college said to me at the end of our term…

“You know, you really are as smart as you think you are”

🙂

INTJ also-although the J is weaker than the rest. My guess is if you replied to this post you are an idealist or rational, if you went to test or retest (or added it to your to do list) you are a guardian, and if you are an artisan–well you didn’t finish the post and aren’t reading this anyway 🙂

Another INTP here, though I do love travel and minimalism as an end in itself. The only type I can’t possibly relate to is the Guardian – yuk!!

ERE and Myers Briggs stuff just makes me laugh. I went and redid the test and find I’m a definite INTJ this time and realised why I enjoyed this site so much.

I have come across some psychologists who insist one is one type all one’s life or perhaps only change slightly where one is at a cross over point. Well when I lived in a rigid community I was a strong ESTJ – what they needed and wanted. When I went to university to write my thesis on unexpected recovery from disease I did the test again, this time an INFP – definitely and happy doing this (Keirsey temperament Healer). Later as I was having to do some teaching I became an ENFJ temporarily (KT Teacher) but decided that wasn’t me and I didn’t like it. I focussed instead on my research and writing journal articles for publication and found myself an INFJ. Wasn’t particularly happy there either and so retired when I could. Now I am the INTJ and probably was most of my life. I’ve never been happier.

Oh how it is to have a job which tests and retests you every couple of years. But I’m sorry I didn’t know this ERE 10 years ago – but then I didn’t have my husband on board back then. I do now and as long as he is allowed his little luxuries of superb coffee in the morning and a red wine at night he puts up with my frugality in other areas.

Its a pity my husband and I are both in our 60s now so we can’t have an early retirement, but perhaps we can have A Retirement. Also I’m sure our grandson is an INTJ also and even at 9 years he can save like anything.

[…] values more internally focused than is probably typical is society. Jacob ERE had an article called everything explained where he called out how the different personality types valued different things in life. However, […]

I’ve been still wondering and looking for an answer to that curiosity why your blog had focused my attention more than others (famous in the topic of ER/FI, i.e. MMM’s one). Now I have the solution: my INTJ/INTP profile 😉 (with J-P no preference).
Generally, I think that blogs like yours gather similar people and there are far more INTJs among readers than in those 2% from general population.

However, I am a cognitive psychologist who does not believe in stable personality traits too much, but rather more in influence of cognitive and environmental factors. I consider impulsivenes, patience, self-control, self-esteem, self-confidence, other “selfs”, risk attiude, learning, long-term thinking etc. as more substancial than personality …

BTW, now I have some turning point in my academic career and (perhaps similarily to you?) I consider ER/FI/no occupation/free-lancing/entrepreneurship as a tempting opportunity 🙂 …