Not only a vegan, which is not difficult at all compared to 20 years ago, but I’m a believer in fasting.

“Oh my God, you are not going to eat food for a week? You’re nuts!” Well, as a matter of fact, “Yes I am. Thank you very much.”

I fully understood the point of this post, but fail to see why what one does or does not do,is any of anyone else’s business.
After all we only answer to ourselves.

@vga,
Is it not true, that the opposite is also true, i.e., someone else telling you “WoW, you mean you don’t use a Car to get around (to the shop in the corner!!)? Doesn’t your company pay you well enough? You are torturing your DW (who’s gone livid at thoughtless remarks already by now) by ‘depriving’ her of a car?! Do you need some help from us?….” 😉 Well, if the above sentence is meant to be “well-meaning” so is the connverse remark that our “Shakespeare” here is suggesting… (Finished with the title yet, oh bard? ;-))

@Jacob,
For once, I can break this site’s mutual rule and say “I agree with this post” 😀 and been there myself. I am not an INTJ, so sometimes these things do get to me…..

@et,
More likely, you did not notice…. A really large majority is surprisingly outspoken when it comes to stuff (‘Misery’ loves company, you know)!!

@Jacob,
I too go through the same pangs as et while considering investments… As a sociopath INTJ, you are more interested in right here, right now… where’s the meaning you may add… but do you think of the eco/sustainability aspect of a company?? Or you think like Lomborg? 😉

Best,
Surio.

I have lived in the same studio apartment (a co-op so I own it) for the last 21 years, so I can’t accumulate too much stuff despite good closet space.

Being a childfree atheist who retired 18 months ago at age 45 (and who doesn’t want to own a cell phone) puts me into at least 4 minority groups, not that I care about that. [Some people know I am in all 3 of those groups, others know I am in some but not all of those groups.] I would not trade any of those things for anything.

Jacob,
I just realised (Yup.. a little dim today :-()! This is a non publishing post! Does that mean we are back to normal scheduling 😉

🙂
Surio.

Hmm, I think Tracy has a point about Europeans’ attitudes being different. I don’t know why, maybe we haven’t revelled quite so much in the whole ‘material standard of living’ culture which has the US in its thrall (present company excepted, of course 🙂 )

There is a big irony there, isn’t there? In the ‘land of the free’ and of the ‘rugged individualist’ (which I’m sure most US consumerists would self-identify with), there is a much bigger premium on social, religious and consumptive conformity.

I’m sure there’s a study in there for an intrepid sociologist willing to collate real data, as opposed to my sweeping generalistaions 😉

This Onion article seems relevant to the subject at hand:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/temp-hides-fun-fulfilling-life-from-rest-of-office,49/

I wouldn’t dream of actually saying anything to friends about how much/how little stuff they have unless they ask my opinion. I am highly imperfect thus deflecting/projecting my imperfect view onto someone else just takes away from what I should be doing to correct my own situation. What they do with their money/time is their business. The fact that I am emptying out my house of stuff and not replacing it is easily explained should someone ask me what I’m doing (which they haven’t): ‘I’m getting ready to RV full time and I don’t want a pile of stuff to deal with!’ Stuff = ball n chain IMO but many people aren’t ready to see it that way.

@macs said it well:

“There is a big irony there, isn’t there? In the ‘land of the free’ and of the ‘rugged individualist’ (which I’m sure most US consumerists would self-identify with), there is a much bigger premium on social, religious and consumptive conformity.”

It may have been the initial sense of space and mistaken sense of ownership that the original err… “revolutionaries” had which gave birth to this “me, me, me, all mine” attitude, but I don’t think it works in the other direction – I don’t think it is a “lack of space” that has allowed Europeans to develop such moral independence, etc. After all, the original development of legal tolerance etc. came from Europe at a time when the population was much, much, much less. So it’s not really a factor of population.

I don’t really care what people think about my lifestyle and rarely do I care about theirs. Though my lifestyle probably is not that different from the majority, besides not owning a TV.

It does seem to me that you are being a little condescending to people who accumulate stuff, Jacob. But isn’t materialism just another lifestyle that is just as right as yours? It’s a personal decision how one wants to live and materialism can be just as good a minimalism.

[…] Dealing with well-intended advice via @extremejacob […]

religious and ethnic minorities, vegans, homosexuals, the highly intelligent, and people who choose not to have children.

Well, I got four out of five. No wonder I’m always pissed off. 🙂 Although, I’m tempted to say that the last two are redundant. 🙂

Jacob

this is completely unrelated to this post, but I came across this the other day and thought it would be right up your alley: http://www.survivalblog.com/2010/05/motorized_survival_bikes_by_ji.html

the author comes from a very survivalist standpoint, but I’m sure you can appreciate the minimalist, do it yourself, and sustainability standpoints as well.

I’d love to see the look on someone’s face when you said that last paragraph.

I wish I could live by HSpencer’s advice, but I too find myself affected (probably too much) by what other think and say.

I don’t get this sort of advice. I do catch some slack for not having a cell phone when people want to reach me, but that’s about them, not me. And when my friends get new tech toys, they show them off to me, but that’s because they’re excited about them, not because I must be assimilated.

I think it helps that I have just about the lowest salary of anyone I know, so they can easily tell themselves that my lack of expenditures is based on a lack of income rather than on refusing to spend money I actually have.

They did used to tell me I should get better jobs, but they couldn’t come up with any ideas other than programming.

“[From a] financially free/independent … perspective, owning a lot of products indicates only one thing: failure.”

That’s inapplicable to the very wealthy, which isn’t a population that can just be written off. I know a number of “financially free/independent” people who own tons of property and expensive toys.

Seeing so many people I know around me, bearing material things definitely makes me contemplate what their balance sheets are really going to tell me.

I agree with ourtakeonfreedom in which that particular rule is inapplicable. Because it’s a sign that one is pretty much already at the border of financial independence. The rich buy luxuries last, while the rich buy luxuries first.

@AJ

“Materialism would be just another harmless lifestyle if it didn’t affect other people. But the more stuff people buy, more is made, more energy is used, which affects us all through global warming, peak oil, etc. Minimalism doesn’t affect anyone but the person practicing it, and maybe the people they live with, and even then, not in any way even close to global warming.”

Your argument does not make sense from a logical stand point.

In the case of consumerism you state that the action of one person (the consumer) will have a profound effect on the whole.

Yet, in the case of minimalism, the action of the individual has no effect on the whole.

You need consistency in your argument:

EITHER

The individual has an effect on the whole. I.E., one Consumer hurts the environment and one Minimalist hurts progress and stock market returns (by reducing growth).

OR

The choice of one individual is negligible vis-a-vis the whole. Therefore, the choice that we make ourselves have no effect on others.

My eyes were opened the first time i went to Tokyo for 2 weeks as a 6’2, 200 lb American.

None were over 5’8. All weighed less than 170 lbs.

Body fast was from 5-15%.

You could walk around and be like, “Oh she’s a tiny bit fat, thank goodness i am not the only one, but then realize she’s pregnant.”

When you come back to the states, all you want to eat is Fish, vegetables, and fruits because you are so much more self conscience. All you want to do is bike and walk everywhere, instead of driving on fat thrones all day. (Even their vehicles are meant for small thin people, with seat belts that will squeeze you. Their Semi-trucks are the size of American Ford F150’s.)

Great post. I will try the strategy outlined. I always get it in the neck for not having much and am thought of as a miser even though I am happier than other people. Excellent post. Thanks for sharing. Short and sweet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQVE467nBMA

“You Ain’t Me”